A Second Look: Concept Ideas to make the Bow a Primary Weapon

Discussion in 'Suggestions & Feedback' started by Ryfox III, Jun 18, 2015.

  1. Ryfox III

    Ryfox III Green Slime

    So this is another gamers hope that the bow would be considered to be worked on to make it a primary weapon in the future. Personally I have always been a big fan of the archer and those showing the patients and determination to become one both in real life and in some games.

    Reply to MrChocodemon from Developer Teddy on his forum topic regarding ideas to make the bow a primary weapon.

    This is an impressive write-up, but it pains me to simply say that making the bow a primary weapon is very unlikely. We used to have a bow as a primary weapon (with skills and all), and it simply either ruined everything else by being so strong that it was silly to play with anything else, or it had to be nerfed so much (because range is very, very strong) that even players that liked bows didn't find it satisfying. The way it works now the bow serves a purpose, whether it's for quick spam damage like some use it for, or assassination like other use it for.

    I'm sorry if it sounds like I'm not even considering this. Wehaveconsidered it a lot, and there have been much discussion about it in the old beta forums. But at the end of the day, the game became better when we turned the bow into a secondary weapon, and while perhaps a primary bow could have a place in our game it would take so much work to fine tune it we'd rather put into creating new content.

    Reading this topic and a few others that popped up on trying to encourage a return to working on the bow as a primary weapon was a bit discouraging. Does this make the game become less fun? Far from it! Even playing the demo for the short time that I played (Or rather long trying out different combinations and finding out what direction I want to try going for my main style of play in this game) has show to be quiet fun even just playing the older unfinished version from start to finish. Players, well they have their likes and dislikes and in a game that encourages customization there will be some in the group that when they pick up the bow they will have an inner child that has played a game where they used it as a primary weapon and will wish it was in this game. I’m sure many will probably feel a throw back to The Legend of Zelda where the bow was a secondary weapon in that game and enjoy the little throwback.

    I understand and I respect the direction that the Developers of the game wish to go with their work but I am a bit sad to say that I am one of those gamers who has played a lot of games that give you the freedom to play with a multitude of classes and I do have a love for the archer class save so far from one game. (Admittedly I am a bit of an enjoyer of being OP as an archer having done a lot of soloing in these other games.) So hearing that there is a very unlikely shot the bow will ever be looked at as a primary weapon again is saddening. So this is a topic where I do hope that it will be looked over by the developer as a way of encouragement to give the bow another look at in the future and a bit of a help from a fan of the game and a person who has tried making a game himself before in Game Maker. Even a simple game can take time to make and understanding how to code and trying to make it work right is far from easy and you have my respect to make it this far and share what you have done to other gamers is very commendable.

    I apologize for this topic having quiet a few pages to start. I have done a lot of thinking and a lot of writing over the course of a few days.
    Teddy likes this.
  2. Ryfox III

    Ryfox III Green Slime

    What to look for in the Bow and What could be Used to Try and Make a Primary Bow Fair.

    Yes I can agree on what the developers say on the subject. A bow really any ranged weapon in general can get really OP and very broken when made a certain way. This section I wish to throw down some ideas that I have had to help broaden the perspective of the Bow and how to try and make it fair for the game and for those playing it. Right now this is just on the Bow primary function. I’ll share ideas on Skills later down the line.

    Arrows do not do a whole lot of damage:

    Looking at a real life perspective, a tiny piece of metal vs a slab of sharpened of it is vastly different. Those with swords or any weapon where you get in close can far more significant damage to a monster like cutting off a limb, opening them up and making them bleed out, cutting them in half in the ridiculous anime style of things to name a few. A tiny piece of metal would ether get stuck in a monster or pierce right through. While it really goes for both. Archers/Rangers really have to focus on finding weak points on a target to reduce shooting as many arrows into the target as possible and working to move to the next until the threat has been dealt with. While you can’t do that in this game having no really weak spots and respawning enemies, To reduce the damage equal or slightly lower then a one handed weapon will have the player question “Is this the direction I really want to go playing this game?” This kinda shows that the bow is not like any other weapon and it will play far differently then going up and just swinging away. This also shows that the Developer are thinking of the players when they give them options in that customization that they want to try and please the gamer while also making the game fair and fun. Or at least that is how I feel.

    A Simple Key Press and Holding the Key Down:

    This is the start of our look on the bow in game and the most simple of mechanic to work on. Do you want the arrow to just go flying off with a push of a key or do you want to have the player hold the button to charge the weapon like a real bow? Well what would you have in these options?

    Key Press – Push a key, arrow goes flying. What is more to say about this?

    Holding the Key Down – This would give the bow a more bow like feel to the weapon and it would add an option. Just press the key would do very minimal damage like as minimal as say the one handed sword or even less. Holding the key to a maximum charge and you could have the damage as powerful as say the two handed sword. Holding the key would also give the player a chance to move like they do with all charging abilities and align their shots better.

    So two very easy mechanics but ultimately a tough balancing act to work maybe? Well what about the arrows and the energy based mechanic added to the mix?

    Unlimited Arrows, Limited Arrows, and Energy:

    Three of the main aspects of the Bow and what would be ultimately fair. So let me try and share some pros and cons on some of the possibilities on this subject.

    Unlimited Arrows – Self explanatory really. Shooting arrow after arrow as many times and as fast as possible as you wish until the monster is dead. The simplest of programming but the hardest to really balance I’m sure.

    Limited Arrows – Again it is a self explanatory subject. Having only so many on hand with forcing the player to really be careful and plan their shots. Slightly more work involved and just as or a tiny bit easier to balance.

    Unlimited Arrows but costing Energy – This is kind of a throw to Monster Hunter. The player has unlimited arrows but they have to draw back and hold a charge in the game to make every shot as strong as possible against the monsters they fight. Making the play style more on run and gun then just spamming the button. This could be the option here or like the spells you can only shoot so many until you run out of stamina and have to wait for the amount you require to shoot again.

    Limited arrows and costing energy – This one really makes the player think and maybe feels a bit more like an archer. Prepping them for the journey and really being careful about every shot. So again this could be like a spell casting class and just pressing a button will send the arrow flying and consume both an arrow and energy or you can hold the key for as long as you have the energy.

    So we have got options to the bow and more ideas in the bottomless bag to think about. We got pressing the key and holding the key, we got unlimited and limited arrows as well as energy. Is there more to add to this rather nice verity of ideas? Yes there is! What would straight shots and arching shots be like added to all these options?

    Straight Shots and Arching Shots:

    So far the game shows to be a kind of 2.5D game with flying enemies and flying summons having them out of range of ground characters. Above concepts have been mostly focusing on the straight shots but what if we us Arching Shots? Archers (Wow.. Arching.. Archer.. How did I not see that before?) do have to think about placing their shots as gravity does affect arrows in real life. The higher the angle of the shot the further it will travel. So how would this be in the game? Arch shots also make the archer great for fighting flying enemies as they can reach them without much effort. This would give the Archer a bit of a signature mechanic to their play style in the game and may peak interests in players to try out the bow.

    Key Press – So this would mimic the idea of 3D Dot Game Heroes in its execution. Align yourself and push the key to fire the arrow to land it where your enemy is. You could have it to where the player only has to worry about placing themselves at the right position to hit an enemy. Or you can have it where every shot will consume an arrow and/or energy making them more careful with their shots.

    Holding the Key Down – With this option let us add something to make things easier. The player would have a bit more ease on their mind when trying to get the arrow to hit as they can hold the key to get the right shot. You could add a bit more pressure and make it where the energy goes down slowly and force the player to be on the right spot and shot quickly. Maybe even more pressure when you have to worry about limited arrows.

    Wow! Just having this one option can really make this game ether more interesting or very mean to the player. Well they are only concepts and really they are to the developer options. But yes this can make things a bit harder and show that the bow might become very unfriendly to the player and make them want to avoid it. So let us add some more options to try and make things friendlier. How about loosing arrows?

    Disappearing Arrows and Bouncing Arrows:

    So many of these ideas have one thing in mind are about shooting an arrow, hitting or missing and the arrow disappears. What do I mean by a Bouncing Arrow though? Well what if we give the game the options of ether a chance or even just straight up having the arrows bounce off the enemy and landing nearby as a item you can pick back up. This is more for the limited arrows idea but is another option for it giving the player a bit of relief when they use the bow in the majority of the above ways.

    That should make things a little bit of a more friendly idea for the bow and more stuff to put in the bottomless bag of ideas! That though was for some of the ideas above and mainly for the limited arrows. Let us add something to help make things easier for say, holding the key down.

    Targeting Line:

    Like Monster Hunter when using the bow, holding the attack button and the aim button will bring up a line that shows you a line of how the arrows are going to fly off. This can be done here to and it can help land shots better on all manner of enemies. For the arching shot you can move forward to get the line further out or move back to draw the line closer to you. Straight shots can move from side to side and give their shots a bit more control in the lateral if the player is off center or the target is just not staying still.

    I’m sure there are many more options for the main function of the bow we can put down on this part of the list but for now I’ll leave it with this. So now we have all these lovely ideas on how to make the bow a nice and fun weapon for the game. So how about now we look at some skills that we can give the bow to make even more enjoyable to use as primary weapon.
  3. Ryfox III

    Ryfox III Green Slime

    Skills of the Bow

    So what skills would add to the fun of the bow while still being fair to the game and now other players? Yes how about we ask that question now. What makes a good archer and what makes a bad? Well mostly an archer is used as a supporting class. Ether shooting the same enemy that a melee class is fighting to take that enemy out quickly or finding another target and distracting that one while the melee fighter takes on what number of enemies he can. So with that in mind let us try to see what skills we can add to the bow and what skills should probably be avoided as it doesn’t really hold well to the main ideas of the archer in a multiplayer mechanic in the way we probably want.

    Multi Shoot:

    Ah just to see so many numbers on the screen striking many enemies at once and watching them all fall with a few volleys. So satisfying to watch and do. Yet for what we are asking and what we are trying to do with it I can’t recommended for this. Mostly when an bow has multi shot in a group, ether other players want them in for them making the bow the front man or they become bore or mad to a point where they will kick the bow player because the other players can’t do anything. This also brings up one of the problems you covered. The bow becoming too op and it becomes the favorite if not the only weapon people want to take up. This skill in and of itself can be very abusive and having four players with this. Yeah this game would probably be done in less then a couple of hours if everyone were focusing on building the highest damaging multi shot bow user. I love you Multi Shot but I think for this game you would just be way to abusive to be fun for anyone but us power hungry maniacs.

    Rapid Fire:

    I placed this as a skill because it is something that has been done in games before. Fantasy Life is really only one game I can think of that did this. Charging the weapon and firing arrows in a rapid barrage practically everywhere.. Felt like such a waste.. Anyways. Could this skill work for this game? It might depend how fast and how many arrows are being shot with one cast. Otherwise its probably another skill I couldn’t recommend. It’s a bow, not a machine gun. At this rate we might as well add guns to this game.

    Cross and Wave Shots:

    No. Just no. Sure it was fun in Diablo 2 sending circles of arrows out into groups of surrounding enemies but this game would barely see much use of this or too much use of it depending on which one we are going with. Lets just not go this directions. The bow is already made pretty unrealistic with these ideas.

    Elemental Arrows:

    I have a few ideas behind this. For the most though I was thinking these to be added in the magic tab of the skills menu. Fire Arrows, Ice Arrows, Stone Arrow. Super Sonic Arrow? Phantom Arrow? I think these could go places. Again focusing on what a bow player would play as. These arrows could be used to add debuffs on enemies or maybe add additional damage. Fire Arrow leaving enemies on fire and damaging them over time, maybe making them panic and run everywhere. Ice Arrows slowing or freezing an enemy in place making it easier to hit them or prevent them from attacking your other friends to often. Stone Arrows could maybe daze or stun the enemy and leave them immobile for a few seconds. I mean would you move normally if you got hit with a rock? Air is a bit tricky. Could make them like a pierce arrow, could maybe hold wind like arrows. Maybe the arrows would spin so fast making tornadoes that could push enemies away. I think air has a lot going for it but what one would be the unique arrow to go with?

    More Passive Skills to the Bow:

    So as it was said the bow in and of itself is already pretty OP being a ranged weapon. So what about having a majority of the skills in the weapon tab passive skills? If the bow is already good then maybe what it needs is not more ways of killing the enemy but more ways to improve oneself while using the bow.


    One of the nice things about being a ranged fighter in some games is the ability to use traps. Sometimes enemies just won’t hold still for a good shot so why not have some traps laid down and make things a little easier for yourself and even your friends? This could also fit into the magic tab if we are not looking at some traps like cages or bear traps. Magma Pit, Icy Mine, Vine Snare, Vortex, just to name for each element and just to name a few for magic.

    Arrow Throw and Retreat:

    Sometimes you might find yourself with enemies that are just too close to you for a good shot. Why not throw an arrow in the enemies face and stun them for a chance to fall back. Or maybe have a skill that lets you hop back out of danger. Or maybe both throw the arrow then a back hope. Or maybe throw three arrows to make a bit of an obstacle that enemies would trip over or act as a wall that enemies would be slowed down by it. I think this option can get very creative.

    These are just some Skill ideas to try and be a bit outside of the box even though many games have already used these concepts. I think what makes this section enjoyable is the creativity to think up some rather enjoyable skills and fun to watch for both the single player and multiple players.

    So I hope that I have enlighten a bit of a spark in the Developers and brought some more ideas to the table to give this bow another look and hopefully another chance to be glanced over and tried again to become a primary weapon that everyone, both the player using the bow and the players with the bow user, can have fun and just really enjoy. This is not a request to halt everything because fans really want the bow to be something more then a simple push of a button. This is just left as something to give the bow a second look. That it can be done, maybe all it needs is a look at from a different perspective. I do apologize if I make this sound like a wanting to get this back in right now kind of topic and if in all this writing I end up accidently loosing a few readers in confusion on what I am exactly saying on some sections if not all of this. For those who have taken the time to read through my overly long winded writing I thank you for your time and I hope this brings a little bit of creative thinking in all of you for whatever you do. If there are any questions feel free to ask and I will do what I can to answer them as soon as I am able.

    Mahalo and Aloha!
  4. GoodStuff

    GoodStuff Friendly Moderator :)

    I'll be honest here and say that I haven't read a word of what you have typed (but I plan on doing so later when I feel like reading). Since I haven't read anything I don't know if you've seen the other threads about the bow as a primary weapon so I'll just copy paste this from last time someone posted about this.

    This was the last post about this topic (I think): http://secretsofgrindea.com/forum/i...bows-more-properties-more-fun.3065/#post-9291

    We've had a lot of bow discussions before. If you haven't read them already then maybe you can find these interesting. :p


    Also this is what Teddy said in the last link where we talked about the bow as Primary Weapon:
    "This is an impressive write-up, but it pains me to simply say that making the bow a primary weapon is very unlikely. We used to have a bow as a primary weapon (with skills and all), and it simply either ruined everything else by being so strong that it was silly to play with anything else, or it had to be nerfed so much (because range is very, very strong) that even players that liked bows didn't find it satisfying. The way it works now the bow serves a purpose, whether it's for quick spam damage like some use it for, or assassination like other use it for.

    I'm sorry if it sounds like I'm not even considering this. We have considered it a lot, and there have been much discussion about it in the old beta forums. But at the end of the day, the game became better when we turned the bow into a secondary weapon, and while perhaps a primary bow could have a place in our game it would take so much work to fine tune it we'd rather put into creating new content. :("

    Happy reading. :D
  5. KoBeWi

    KoBeWi Jumpkin

    lol, he actually says in first few paragraphs that he has read it, @GoodStuff (giving even exactly the same quote). That's why this topic is called Second Look.
  6. The G-Meister

    The G-Meister Giga Slime

    One point I can make:

    Earth Spike and Meteor are ranged. They're also incredibly overpowered when used correctly, and are more accurate than the bow currently is. My mage build works extremely well... So why not the bow?

    I'm not on anyone's side here, because:

    Option 1: We reconsider the bow and convert as seen here.
    Option 2: If you want range, use Earth Spike and Meteor
  7. GoodStuff

    GoodStuff Friendly Moderator :)

    Sorry @Ryfox III , I'm lazy. :#
  8. KoBeWi

    KoBeWi Jumpkin

    Ok, I just read all of it. But I didn't read any other topic about bows so I don't know if this one brings much new to the subject :p
    But I have some idea how to make bow a bit less OP: make it decrease mobility. There could be some movement drawback (but I don't know what exactly) that will force you to shoot very carefully. You can gain initiative at the beginning, but when you use bow, the distance becomes less safe (some recoil or something to make player more exposed to enemy attacks). The problem on bows is that you can just run and spam, so making them more stationary and less spamful sounds like an potion.

    Also, the better skill than Multi-Shoot (at least for me) is Arrow Rain. ;)
  9. Ryfox III

    Ryfox III Green Slime

    I haven't really tried Meteor sadly so no idea what that is like. Earth Spike was a fun spell to goof around with.

    So one of the things I was trying to address is the full customization concept that the developers have pointed out in their trailer. Giving players freedom to make their character however they want. So far looking through this forum sections. There have been a couple or few bow topics wanting to bring primary function back to the bow. What I tried to do differently is not to just flat out put in, "This is 'my' ideas on how to make a primary bow." with like everything laid out. Its laying out as many possible concepts onto the table and share what the bow can do if it was given a second look to becoming a primary weapon again.

    Another thing I wanted to point out is not everyone likes being op. Some look at a particular build and suddenly they will feel they have to build it exactly as they see because its the only way to have fun or to get through the story mode. Others if you are playing multiplayer will start to feel useless as they can't do anything but watch as meteors and earth spikes are crashing and killing everything in sight, leaving them ether to sit their or trying to catch up. If the player is more then capable then killing enemies by themselves, why even have a multiplayer option?

    This shares a different playstyle that could be added to the game for players to experiment and experience outside of others. Giving the player a feeling of uniqueness which might be one idea the developers were trying to look into while making this game.

    This isn't simply just another topic of "Oh please make the bow primary please please please!?" but just sharing ideas to give the bow a second look and a second thought before just completely throwing the idea out the window because it was just too hard to balance.
  10. Ryfox III

    Ryfox III Green Slime

    I had given Arrow Rain some thought to put up there but really looking on it its like a mix of Multi-Shot, Rapid Fire in ways and Wave Shot. Arrows would come down on an enemy or a group of enemies in an AoE with multiple arrows piercing down on them probably costing one arrow or a lot of energy. Yes it is really cool to watch but again being like the three its a trick to really balance and it falls into the OP where things might just die too quickly to where ether the player breezes through the story too quickly and can't admire all the hard work put in or other players playing with them will just feel they have to build their character like that or just feel useless.
  11. Ryfox III

    Ryfox III Green Slime

    No worries brah. I know I write a lot and it was another topic on a Primary Bow. I wanted to make sure though that I wrote something different from the previous ones otherwise it would just sound like another fan wanting the developers to halt everything for what was really already looked at for the umpteenth time. Least I hope it doesn't sound like what I wrote above..
  12. The G-Meister

    The G-Meister Giga Slime

    True, but at the current difficulty of the game in hard mode, you HAVE to be OP. It's very hard to take a poor build all the way to Winter, and I'd like to change that... Soon we'll be getting fleshed-out prototype gold charges to mess around with, which'll be fun, but still we're talking a whoooole bunch of balancing here to make sure everything is good enough to not be worth rage-quitting at. I've just taken this mage build to Winter (as of a few minutes ago, in fact), and I had to pick the skills wisely or I would've been there forever. Although it'd be nice to have a bow class, I think we're a little caught up with these Gold Charges and the Steam release. Downside, devs might not consider this at all. Upside, more time to chat about it ^-^
  13. Ryfox III

    Ryfox III Green Slime

    Yeah It will be nice when it comes out on Steam and Gold Charges I'm sure will be very fun to experiment and goof around with. Yeah it will be sad if it just gets an overlook and not even a reply but with all things considered its just three people doing all the development and art for the game; keeping up with forum topics that might go by quickly would be a tiring read as well I bet. Mages are really cool but I just always had trouble playing as them. I never really know how to build them properly so I end up ether with a lack of proper spells or too many powerful spells that leave me mana burned too many times to where I might as well have a life support of a mana tank strapped and sticked on me at all times. I think its why I like the archer. Yeah their are the limited arrows in many but I think I have grown accustom to micromanaging my ammo and in some games traps.
  14. The G-Meister

    The G-Meister Giga Slime

    You wait until I make a video on this build. It takes into account EP cost, damage, close and long range enemies and works well against both groups of normal enemies and bosses. The simple fact that EP regenerates means that with a ranged build (Earth Spike and Meteor) it doesn't matter how long it takes to regen, as long as you're competent enough to dodge anything and everything.

    On a side note:
  15. Ryfox III

    Ryfox III Green Slime

    Yeah this guy. Wonder if he was placed there as kinda a hint on the attempt at making the bow a primary weapon before?
  16. Akira

    Akira Rabby

    Holy crap, sorry but tl;dr o_O

    I know from other RPGs and MMORPGs, even an open source one in which I helped with some development together with my cousin, that balancing is very, and I mean very, difficult with ranged weapons such as a bow. It's already hard to find something that works in theory for the moment but that doesn't mean that it will really work in the end. Also note "for the moment": SoG is still in development and every future content expension and rework will get harder in order to not break things. It might sound a bit exaggerated but I experienced it myself.

    Since I'm very happy with the current balancing of the game and the bow itself I'm not a big fan of changing it. Of course I can understand that wish though.

    Btw IMO Pixel Ferrets had some insanely good ideas about the battle system. Just wanted to mention it.
  17. Teddy

    Teddy Developer Staff Member

    Yet another impressive write-up on bow mechanics! I will reiterate my statement that I acknowledge that the game would most certainly be better with a perfectly balanced main weapon bow with a full set of skills to accompany it.

    The important question for us as developers (for every design decision) boils down to: how much better will the game become relative to the development time of the feature?

    Making the bow a main weapon will mostly please fans of the hunter lore. Mechanically, there are skills that are very similar to how an energy based bow would work (Fireball is essentially an energy based bow, complete with charge time for more powerful shots). In other words, the hole it would fill in the game design is very small, and it would also force us to remove the bow as a secondary weapon (or replacing it with something else). A main weapon bow would mostly be a benefit to the self expression of bow fans.

    We do feel facilitating self expression is important, which is why you can customize your character fairly much (gender, skin color, haircuts, hats, etc), and we're going to broaden those option even more in the future. The problem with the bow, however, is that turning it into a main weapon would result in much, much more work than every other form of self expression currently in the game combined. Making palette swaps possible on the player sprite and a head tracking system for placing hair and hats is super trivial compared to creating assets for, implementing and balancing a new set of skills, especially since they revolve around something so inherently powerful as a bow.

    Imagine the number of side quests, items, minibosses and most importantly hats that would've been sacrificed in order to add a tiny nuance to a fighting system that most players believe is already pretty functional!

    On top of that, consider the risk that we might very well fail in making it both fun and balanced, and you should have a pretty good idea why we don't want to open this particular can of worms.
    Own likes this.
  18. Own

    Own Moderator

    I agree that a bow wouldn't really be too different from the magic system, which is why I don't want to see it become a primary weapon. I enjoy the bow as a tool, like any other Legend of Zelda-esque tool item.

    There's only so many different ways you can make mechanics for attacking at a range and I think between the magic system and Throw, the game has them all covered. :D

    If the bow did get upgrades, I'd only want to see it in the form of Talents that unlock when you get the bow, not Skills. Talents require no additional animation. But even then, you only get a limited number of arrows. Why sink talents into something you can only use rarely? The alternative is infinite arrows which is ridiculously broken.
  19. Ryfox III

    Ryfox III Green Slime

    Yeah I'm a bit of a writer when I have ideas playing in my head ^^;; sorry about that

    I don't know what it is like to work on a really big project but I can understand even from the brief attempt to make a game how much work and effort goes into making one. Seeing RPGs out there doing their best to balance everything is a very tedious process and even minor tweaks can make or break a game.

    I can't ask the developers to just completely stop working on a game that is only in beta for one thing and I will not ask such a thing. For the most it is a fan sharing ideas amongst the community to show and inspire in another way other artists and creators ideas outside the box that can be looked at and laid out in the future. Even if in the end of the project the idea never sees the light of day it at the very least the person got it out there.
  20. Ryfox III

    Ryfox III Green Slime

    Reading this I am glad that more and more are being laid out as to why this idea has to be thought at in the no category as well.

    Again, a lot of fans point out this is only beta and the game is getting closer to a release or another beta release. The Dev Logs also share what a lot is going on for fans to enjoy and get hyped up for the next release.

    Again I can't ask for you to just halt everything and more so now with what you shared what is being worked on and just what can happen to a point where everything is going to be reworked. It would be too soon right now and I am sure just as the fans the developers have lots of ideas they wish to get down and try to get into the game as well.

    I'm glad though that with this read you feel you got a little more inspiration to keep going and try more things, even if in the end the bow never sees primary I do look forward to seeing where this game will go with the inspiration that keeps you all going.

    This will be it for me. There is only so much I can lay out on my end for the bow and really I think we have left enough for a satisfying conclusion. I still have ideas and with work, life, and my own personal art projects its gonna be a bit to jot down my next idea.

    Thank you very much for your time to read and sharing your side as well and good luck as you continue with your game sir. ^^

    Aloha Haha!
    Teddy likes this.

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