My suggestions

Discussion in 'Suggestions & Feedback' started by Jason, Apr 22, 2014.

  1. Jason

    Jason Green Slime

    Starting from the top... This will be a TL DR for most of you...

    General
    - Add in a stamina gauge - link normal attacks, defending, and running to it

    - Include the option to run, default move speed feels sluggish, especially when returning to areas

    - Drop rates - For the love of god, be the first game to ever use an intelligent RNG + system.

    First time its 1/100 odds to drop something, if that doesn't happen, next time is 1/50 odds, if it still doesn't happen 3/100 odds... So that each subsequent monster kill makes it more likely that they will drop the item (card or whatever). When that item drops it resets to the default

    So if a monster had 3 drops
    1/5 Carrot
    1/100 Rabbit foot
    1/250 Card

    You would never go more than 5 kills without having a carrot drop, never more than 100 without a rabbits foot, and never more than 250 without the card dropping... Realistically you would hit a point where the odds would tip into your favour. Still lots of grinding? Yup... Even with terrible base odds at least you feel that you are achieving something with every kill, instead of rolling a die every time.

    Amazes me that no such system has been put into any game (TTBOMK) yet...

    - Include a mini-map option on the screen

    - Include a multiplayer / summon off screen indicator (a circle with an arrow or something) to give a general indication of where your friend wandered off too

    Specifics

    Spells and Skills
    -
    biggest thing is to reflect what kind of an increase is actually given... instead of +damage give the actual damage caused by the spell and an indication of the increase, or a % increase

    Combat - I Can't comment as I was playing a mage / summoner exclusively, I will only comment on those skills I used.

    The best thing that any RPG game was adding customization to skills, either gems or other skills that modify them... Multi shot, altering effects, etc.

    Support
    - Protect - Helps a bit
    - Haste - The casting time vs the duration time makes this useless

    Suggestions - Swap them from an activated to a passive that has a reserved cost

    Frosty Fiend - Probably a staple for most people, needs to show you if he falls off screen, starts off quite powerful hitting for as much damage as you do, and then trails off mid game, to becoming nothing more than a one hit meat shield late game. Needs reworking in his role... is he supposed to be damage, tank, or what?

    Summon Plant - Cute, but utterly useless. Needs to be reworked in terms of its damage / range or make it a turret skill that fires - Think hydra from diablo

    Insect swarm - Very, very powerful, easily better than any other spell my brother or I tried... I hear that the fire cone one is even better yet but didn't try it myself.

    Chain lightning - Very, very weak, clearly needs a buff

    Cloud strike - Added damage from above, seems to be about right for what it is

    Treasure Maps
    - I like the concept, but tell me why are the check marks for finding them different colours, why do they not go in order of 1-8, why don't they give a general location before the specific one

    Enemies
    - I like them, very secret of mana-esq
    - Would be nice if you could make boss enemies occur when you kill X number of regular ones, on top of just randomly happening (which I assume isn't in the non-arcade part)

    Cards and Drop rates
    - Like I mentioned in general - PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF ALL THAT IS HOLY use an intelligent RNG + system

    Otherwise, the cards is a neat feature, probably will need tooling balance wise as it goes

    World Map

    Probably a beta thing, but judging from how much is so far uncovered, it feels like the world is going to be very very small

    - Should include information like - active quests, treasures not found, chests not opened, etc when you hover over an area, how many treasure maps can be found on it

    Inventory

    The system works for me, clear enough to understand

    Fishing

    Very little reward to this, but then it is very simple... You should make it so that you have a fishing exp level, at certain levels you just automatically catch certain fish.

    Archery

    The house, basically you need a perfect run for the first 10-12 shots to be able to win it, not saying it was hard, just saying that the way its done requires that

    Puzzles
    I like them, would be nice to get more variety but I assume that is a beta thing

    Crafting

    Pretty simple to do, would be nice if you added a mini-game to it as well, one that didn't destroy the items if you fail to do it of course, but that would make you do something to get the item

    Healing

    Is it just me or did I completely miss having any option to heal aside from returning to town and the red blood orbs slain enemies drop?

    This may be intentional, or may just not have the items included yet

    Potions

    Basically nullify the need to not spam spells, or use haste / protect at all

    Pets

    Cute, I don't mind the minigame - but the attack and the defend keys need to be differentiated from the rest, right now they are not distinct enough. Later monsters with faster speeds etc will make that even worse... I suggest making attack RED and defend BLUE or something along that line

    Otherwise, feeding my pets, it takes a ton of food to get it to increase by one level, but seems like it didn't take any more to get the following level or the one after it...

    Each type of pet should have a specific levelable general buff - EX:

    Rabbits - Attack and Cast faster for yourself and allies
    Pumpkin - Increase the physical attack of yourself and allies

    Finally pets should have a visible / invisible option

    Arcade Mode

    Seems cute, but it would be nice if you retained 1/4th of the exp you got from the previous run

    So

    First run = Start at Level 1, reached level 10
    Second run = Start at level 4, reached level 16
    Third run = Start at level 7, reached level 9
    Fourth run = Start at level 3, killed right away
    Fifth run = Start at level 1

    So only the previous run directly benefits you, and one terrible run ends it

    Or maybe spend statues to start at increased levels

    1 statue for each starting level should be enough of a slowdown on it


    I probably can think of more but I'm done typing for now

    MY top three

    #1 RGN + system
    #2 Skill buffs - Multi-shot, type change, etc
    #3 Mini map and World map info
     
    CrazyBoy.2014 and Pok like this.
  2. Jason

    Jason Green Slime

    Guess I can't edit

    Pets

    You should only get 1 pet that can morph into the enemy types that would then give it a look (unless you wanted it invisible) + a racial buff

    That way you can feed your pets without forgoing having one as a buddy until you find the type you want
     
  3. GoodStuff

    GoodStuff Friendly Moderator :)

    "Treasure Maps
    - I like the concept, but tell me why are the check marks for finding them different colours, why do they not go in order of 1-8, why don't they give a general location before the specific one" - Jason

    So the different colour is because they are different hints. Some show a picture and some are just text, right? If they are not going from 1-8 that's because you haven't found all of them. They get separated into two lists, that's not very clear but they do. Not cleared maps list from 1-8 and straight underneath the last not cleared is the first cleared going from 1-8. If you clear 2,5,7 then your list will be: 1,3,4,6,8,2,5,7. :p
     
    camelotcrusade likes this.
  4. Jason

    Jason Green Slime

    But their are three different colour of check marks if memory serves

    #1 blue
    #2 red
    #3 green
    #4 blue
    #5 red
    #6 green
    #7 green
    #8 red

    ah ok looking at them now I get it

    Blue is in game screen shot
    Red is written hint
    Green is hand drawn map
     
  5. Aurophobia

    Aurophobia Halloweed

    You just blew my mind.

    You forgot to add that there should be an instant unlock everything button.
     
    Eriktion likes this.
  6. Jason

    Jason Green Slime

    Sarcasm eh?

    Oh I'm sorry didn't realize that this forum existed under a bridge.

    Their is a difference between mindless stupidity and enjoyable gameplay.

    "Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again but expecting different results" - Albert Einstein

    You appear to enjoy mindless stupidity. Wonder why.

    Anything that polishes the experience is a plus, grinding endlessly is a negative.

    As it stands, I've killed guardian enough times to get 93 crystals, I expect the kill rate is in the thousands at this point. NO card has dropped for this monster (or possibly its a bug and it dropped but I left the screen before getting it)... So yes I am insane for keeping at it. But those who want the flawed system to remain are worse.
     
  7. GoodStuff

    GoodStuff Friendly Moderator :)

    It's a grinding game.... If you can get the items you want in 5 minutes then the game would be boring and short. Yes the farming can get out of hand from time to time because you can be really unlucky, 8 hours of killing the Lantern Jacks was maybe not that fun, but atleast I expect the game to make me work hard for everything I can collect. If they bring in an intelligent RNG system then they might be able to control the farming better and we could probably calculate an estimated time to aquire each item, which would be pretty cool and helpful. If the RNG system gets an update then it has to be really well executed so that the farming don't become to easy. :D Then again, I might not be the right person to judge this because I've put in around 150 hours into this game...
     
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2014
  8. Jason

    Jason Green Slime

    All you need to do is calculate the odds of an item drop originally then reduce the odds that the intelligent RNG system makes it drop at about the same mark, but if it doesn't then you aren't stuck at terrible odds forever

    Perhaps the fact I dumbed down the concept is what is troubling you... basically...

    The way RNG+ systems work is that something that is a 1/100 drop rate or 1% becomes something that starts at a lower % chance, after 100 kills you statistically get one with the RNG+ system, if you haven't gotten one by then your odds start to climb until you do at a linear rate of gain

    You just tinker the starting rates to low, so yeah killing one enemy isn't a 1/100 chance of getting said item

    Not the exact numbers here but its the concept


    Something that was 1% odds becomes something like

    You might start at 1/150, by 100 kills you are at 2/3 odds of getting it, from every kill

    the first 50 kills you have worse odds, the next 50 better, eventually its a given that you get the item.

    But the thing is the "time filler" content of "gameplay hours" isn't spent banging your head against a wall, you know that every kill you are that much closer, its a psychological reward system that is drastically more addictive than random lottery chance

    Even if the odds were kept the same its easy enough to tinker on the back end the crafting formula to craft something from needing 5 items to needing 10, thus still putting in pointless grinding filler without breaking the primary law of game design

    DO NOT DO THINGS TO INFURIATE THE PLAYER BASE

    The difference between a 3 hour game being a GOTY and a the exact same game as a 300 hour bargin bin disaster is how people like it. Frustrations and stupid design go a long way towards making people dislike a game.

    If they do RNG+ they can bill their game as the FIRST intelligent RPG ever
     
  9. Aurophobia

    Aurophobia Halloweed

    All I'm seeing is you dislike the game because of this system, and you seem to not want the item bad enough. I've fully completed Story Mode, drops, S ranks, and all. I enjoyed it, even going for the drops.

    So if I'm the idiot because I enjoy what I paid for, and you don't, well....I'd rather stay stupid.

    I would also refrain from saying things like "INFURIATE THE PLAYER BASE", everyone is fully capable of voicing their opinion on here, and you're the first one I've seen complain so hard about this topic.
     
  10. I like the idea of making summon plant a turret. I also like the idea of retaining some XP in arcade mode so you have some benefit from previous runs, but honestly I don't play many survival mode games so I am not the best judge of what's appropriate. If arcade mode had a system like this I'd be more inclined to play it, though.

    I do like to grind for rare items so I'm not a fan of making guaranteed drops. Like others have said, I feel the RNG puts the grind in Grindea. That said, it might be OK to create a consumable that gives you a minor boost to finding rares. An accessory would work, too, but I like the idea of it being something you use sparingly.
     
  11. ark626

    ark626 Moderator

    @Jason Please dont insult other forum posters.
    I agree with some of your idea but i have to admit that your post sounds a little like
    "Yeah i played the game but i dont like 90% of the game"

    I appreciate the effort in writing that down but describing other users as "under a bridge" and arrogance is not a wise thing in a forum.

    Also Albert Einstein didn't live in times of events like tunneling of particles etc ;)
    Where you seriously do the same thing over and over and still getting diffrent results.
    And yes many people here are very well educated.

    All i want to say is be little more reflective.
    thanks in advance
     
  12. Fred

    Fred Developer Staff Member

    There's a bunch of valid feedback here that we'll discuss during our next weekly meeting.

    I am not opposed to the idea of the RNG system you're talking about, I actually think it's pretty smart. I'm not a big fan of having a guaranteed drop (at least for rare stuff) after you've killed X amount of said enemy, but that's just the Ragnarok player inside of me speaking up. I do enjoy the struggle of farming for rare items and the satisfaction you get when you finally reach you're goal.

    With that said, increasing the droprate and having a cap at some point that still makes it noticeably more easy to find certain items, I think it's a neat idea. Of course you would have to balance it so you still get that sense of satisfaction when you get the drops, but that's just number tweaking.
     
    Pok likes this.
  13. ark626

    ark626 Moderator

    I Agree with

    I also have to say i agree with some stuff the RNG+ system seems like a nice idea but a bit of fortune and effort should be there not just slaying 100 enemies and getting the item 100% sure.

    Also the haste and other buffs should as you said maybee get a reserved EP points instead of casting them each time they run out.

    I agree with the fishing needs more reward.

    For all other spells i nearly fully agree with your opinion.(besides Frosty Friend)

    I dont Agree with

    I dont agree with the buffs. This idea has come earlier but in my opinion you should not have a pet because of performance. i think it should be a cute cosmetic thing :D

    I also dont agree on the Frosty Friend i used him VERY very much and i like him as he is.

    I wouldnt like a crafting minigame.
    Also i think arcade mode is fine as it is because it IS an Roguelike mode which should be for the skilling of the player not the charakter. And there are some things making it easier(talking about the perks)

    I am not sure about

    For the changing of some core mechanics like stamina for attacks and runnign(which should be added)
    I have splittet emotions on these things. Could be nice but also could make crap out of the gameplay, because everything needs rebalance.
     
  14. Raeden

    Raeden Rabby

    it's called Secrets of GRINDea.
     
  15. ark626

    ark626 Moderator

    @Raeden Yeah and i think @Jason dont want to erease the Grinding out of the game.
    There are just some times Where it can obviously frustrate you if you grind for over 6 Hours and dont get any reward.
    Some system to increase that without removing the grinding WOULD be nice.

    Just increasing the chances if you are farming the same enemies for some time.
    THe idea of it is nice and as this thread already says

    Suggestions only suggestions, nothing of them HAVE to be added to the game because it is not our game to develop its the game of Pixelferrets ;)
     
    Pok likes this.
  16. Jason

    Jason Green Slime

    Didn't start it, wasn't dealt with after a week, figured fine I'll respond in kind.

    Grinding is fine, frustrating grinding; however, is not.

    As for numbers its just something thrown out, nice round easy to see numbers, actual ones could be 0.001% drop rates, insanely low, especially without trading, something to bring the numbers up.

    As far as the game goes, I've S's the arena, done all the quests, have everything except one card (which I'm pretty sure at this point a bug is preventing from dropping), done the arcade.

    At no point have I said I dislike the game, the games good, the point is the game could be better, MUCH better. I do not care for some of the games design, that is the part which could be polished.

    As it stands if the game is launched like this it'll review in at 5.5 - 6.0... Which means only niche people will pay attention to it and a lot of them won't get it.

    If the game is polished, absorbs what others have done correct and has unique features added to it, it stands a shot at being an 8-8.5 game on my scale, and will probably review in at the 9's
     
  17. Adviceowl

    Adviceowl Green Slime

    Which Card?
     
  18. ark626

    ark626 Moderator

    Yes as for the Card there is no bug letting it NOT drop ^^
    Ive played the game in VERY many playtroughts with everything to do and i know how frustrating it can be.
    For me there was the Bee and the Boar card hard to receive ;)

    I appreciate your opinion in very many things. I just said it sounded a little like that and that was the cause why some other Forum users found offending.

    I just said it sounded like that but i dont think that this was the purpose of that post.

    as for me i love the game, and i also think there are many things which could get a polish but i also think that the devs have many things on their to-do list.

    Yeah like it is now i think it is very funny and ive never heared an negative feedback, but as long as the feedback is constructive i also like hearing those negative ones.

    As for the things to change i think there is very much that could be in the game ^^
     
  19. Aurophobia

    Aurophobia Halloweed

    I honestly think you're just unlucky when it comes to that last card. At most, I spent 2 hours in an area to get all the drops and cards, usually less. And honestly, 5.5 - 6.0? Of course they have a lot they need to add, and I agree with many of the skills being useless, but compared to most games at this state, this brought out the most fun and time spent playing from me.

    It's 3 people man, it's gonna be a long work in progress. They have been taking in a LOT of suggestions, and will be working on them.
     
  20. Jason

    Jason Green Slime

    No aurophobia I'm giving it a 5.5-6 as what reviewers will rank it when its got everything currently envisioned for the game put in.

    Obviously not in its current state.
     

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