Use the arcade mode points for stat increases

Discussion in 'Suggestions & Feedback' started by Pok, Apr 22, 2014.

  1. Pok

    Pok Rabby

    Some of my favourite games have had the ability to level up limitlessly and alter your difficulty (Disgaea, Rogue Legacy, Borderlands 2) and I think it would be a good fit for arcade mode. Having the ability to toggle them on and off (or adjust the enemy difficulty up and down) would be nice if you wanted to play with a new person but not feel overpowered compared to them. It would fit the name of the game, an extra 1% health (or whatever) per level doesn't seem like it would be game-breaking, and most importantly it would give a feeling of constant progression and reward in arcade mode.

    I imagine it would be like an arcade mode pet (maybe don't have it follow you since arena maps are small and the pets could clutter it up visually):

    Health, Mana, Damage, Crit, and Speed could use points to level up instead of the single player drops.

    Enemy difficulty (With increased exp / drops / points?) would be 1.25x all enemy stats first and increasing to 1.5x, 1.75x, 2x etc. Maybe put this on a different NPC.

    Both of these systems seem to be in the game already (Pet permanent stat increase and the same monsters having stronger stats in later maps), it would just be nice to have them in arcade mode.

    Thanks for reading.
    Jason likes this.
  2. MrChocodemon

    MrChocodemon Handsome Moderator

    Disgaea stops at either Lv999 or Lv9999
  3. Pok

    Pok Rabby

    Then you can reincarnate and keep some stats, or level your weapons, or use a thief to steal stats :p
  4. Aurophobia

    Aurophobia Halloweed

    9999 is max, and reincarnate infinite times to max out stats for Disgaea.

    Arcade mode is a rogue-like that is pretty much playing a new game each time. They would have to alter so much, just by taking away that concept. Why not stick to Story Mode if you don't like Arcade Mode? Though not every rogue-like is similar, but there is variety by building your character differently and choosing different perks.
  5. RNorthex

    RNorthex Green Slime

    i see the arcade mode as more of a....skill-based rogue-like mode
    the perks are ok to change the style at which you play the game[albeit i still think they shouldn't be objectively better]
    but implementing any benefits would make it closer to the adventure mode
    Raeden likes this.
  6. Pok

    Pok Rabby

    Adventure mode doesn't have the randomness and replayability that arcade mode has which is why I'd like the option in there (I suggested a toggle for the stats too so if it's not your thing that's a possible win:win for both of us).

    Aurophobia, what do you think they'd have to alter? I thought a difficulty slider that would increase monster stats would solve the issue of it becoming too easy while still allowing a feeling of progression.
  7. ark626

    ark626 Moderator

    But that would include a giuantic balancing and change the whole playstyle of arcade
  8. Pok

    Pok Rabby

    I don't think it would require a gigantic rebalancing, the same monsters already get stronger as you progress through the story (or arcade mode), adding in a difficulty slider is kind of like having those later monsters earlier balancing out your leveling.

    As for a change of the playstyle of arcade, it would if you wanted to, it wouldn't if you didn't want it to if the ability to toggle the stat increases on and off (like borderlands 2) was in. Some of the quests would become easier (if you chose to use the stats) but I think it'd be a while before you would even be able to grind up 25% damage (going by how long it takes to level up your pet), so I don't think it'd be game-breaking.

    I think, as it is, only people who are really good at arcade mode will see the later content, people who have their skill plateau at a lower level won't ever get to experience it. Right now it feels quite unfulfilling struggling with the lower floors to even get a peek at the higher ones for a moment before I get crushed.
  9. hepatitisbees

    hepatitisbees Green Slime

    Personally, one of my least favorite things about rogue legacy was that you could basically cash grind your way to victory. I think if you implemented this idea, the stats would have to be minor- like diablo 3 paragon levels minor. Otherwise i dont see it working out, honestly.
  10. Pok

    Pok Rabby

    You can't cash grind yourself to victory mode after you've beaten the game twice, the monsters are significantly harder and the only way to continue to increase your characters stats (after you've maxed the buyables) is by rare chest drops (or beating bosses that don't respawn making you up the difficulty again). The third run-through the stats from chest drops start to become a drop in the bucket and don't really change how your run will go, killing a monster in 4 hits doing 250 damage is the same as killing one in 4 hits doing 252 damage, but the feeling of progression, even if it is almost meaningless, is still nice. If you really wanted to, you could stay in the first difficulty and become quite strong there, but I don't find that a detriment, it's accommodating a different playstyle and in games that are single-player or non-persistent multiplayer I think letting the player play the way they enjoy most is going to attract more buyers.

    I agree that the stats should be minor, but even a minor increase that would have only minor effects still feels like you're being rewarded even if you're doing poorly (and it'll eventually help you get to that later content). If the stats aren't as minor, a difficulty slider would allow those who want to play with stats and have a challenge still have a challenge, while those more casual players could have an easier time on the lowest difficulty.

    The only issue I see is with quests becoming easier as time progresses, but I wonder if that's a bad thing as it should let people who aren't as skilled feel like their making progress therefore extending their playtime.
  11. Aurophobia

    Aurophobia Halloweed

    I feel like if its not game impacting, and works fine how it is...idk. I just got done working for 28 hours recently so my head is scrambled.

    My main point really is to try to keep the system within the confines of perks, and since quests change the setup of the mode, they'll definitely add more. I've had no trouble getting to higher 85% of the time.

    But honestly, I think Teddy is pretty satisfied with how arcade mode is atm
  12. GoodStuff

    GoodStuff Friendly Moderator :)

    This "Difficulty Slider" could just be 4 settings in the menu being, 1,2,3,4 player difficulty. For a solo player going to 4 player difficulty would be like the Red Giga Slime x10 on normal floors. OFC this system wouldn't work if you play with friends but maybe you could have the settings change as more players join so you still have your 4 options. I have no clue on how this would affect the game but speaking my mind won't hurt the game. :D
  13. Pok

    Pok Rabby

    That's an interesting thought, I wonder if the player would get overwhelmed by the sheer numbers on some maps though, I'd give it a try, being swarmed might be interesting.
  14. Pok

    Pok Rabby

    What if mold essence (from the priest guy) took 5 essence of grindea to level up 1% of the pet skills? That doesn't seem overpowered, would still allow the feeling of progression (even if it is incredibly minor) and could still allow the hardcore quests (kill the furious slime) by having it disable the boosts.

    It would encourage people focusing on a build (tanky, STR, magic), but not punishing them if they choose something they didn't like (since it's only additive it is never detrimental).

    5 essences is a lot to farm, it's not like people would be running around with 50% damage anytime soon (and if they did have it, good for them).
  15. Aurophobia

    Aurophobia Halloweed

    You can almost get 5 from every run.
  16. Jason

    Jason Green Slime

    Someone's a concept contrarian.

    Games like Binding of issac lend themselves towards no gain rogue playing, skill is what determines wins there...

    Games with heavy RPG elements don't without very intensive balancing or some persistent stat gain

    Would be nice to have two other arcade modes

    Endless mode - one big room where the enemies just spawn in waves... As you get up on waves they spawn from more sources, etc etc

    Boss crush mode - +1 level per boss room cleared

    Then first room the bandits, next room a pair of boss bandits, then swarm rooms of elite monsters, slime boss, double slime boss, triple slime boss, phaseman, quad phase man, etc

  17. Pok

    Pok Rabby

    I certainly don't... I'm lucky if I get two after beating the first pumpkin boss.
  18. Schattenphoenix

    Schattenphoenix Green Slime

    Good when you havent finished the quest from the priestess...
    That way you can get them quite easily

    Also i dont like the idea of increasing stats with arcade.
    I do like the idea of getting something from arcade (other from cosmetics) but i dont think it should be something as persistent as stats.
    Maybe headgears which are balanced towards the progression in arcade (Pumpkin mobs drop gear according to pumpkin woods) that can be taken over.
  19. Pok

    Pok Rabby

    I've already suggested the idea of having it toggleable, don't like it, turn it off. It seems like it'd be as easy as swapping from your pet in story mode to another pet you haven't put points into.

    Pumpkin hat is 10 def and 20 attack, that'd be about 30 levels on your pet (Probably much more since it would be percentage based and defense is well below 100) that requires very little progression / time spent to get and it would make earlier hat drops useless.
  20. Aurophobia

    Aurophobia Halloweed

    It's just not gonna happen.

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