Binding Ability Swapping

Discussion in 'Suggestions & Feedback' started by Xaax, Apr 26, 2014.

  1. Xaax

    Xaax Green Slime

    I did a quick search through the forum for threads related to this subject, but I could not find anything. Please pardon me if I am bringing up an old idea.

    Anyhow, after getting a controller to work with the game I have noticed something that should have been obvious to me ahead of trying the controller out. There is a severe lack of buttons on the controller. What I mean is that Secrets of Grindea has 24 abilities, 1 primary attack, 1 block, and a bow. Not to mention the button necessary for quickly changing gear upon receiving it, and the buttons used for bringing up the menu and selecting things (esc and enter by default). That's 30 buttons. My controller has 8 plus the D-Pad. Now, I'm sure there are other controllers I could use that would give me more buttons, but I'm not sure that there are any that would give me 30+. And I'm even less certain that such a controller would be comfortable and practical to use.

    So, I propose that a new type of functionality be added. A button to quickly swap between abilities. A lot of games in the past have done this and it works quite well. I imagine using the left and/or right bumper button(s) on the controller to cycle through abilities that my character possesses instead of having to wait until the area is clear in Arcade Mode to go into the menu and switch abilities around to different quickslots.
     
  2. Fred

    Fred Developer Staff Member

    We do use the left/right triggers to allow you to access 2 extra sets of quickslots, giving you a total of 10 quickslots to work with, which is the same amount that can be used on the keyboard. While this wouldn't cover you if you went for a huge number of different skills and wanted to use them all on the fly, I have never really felt the need of more slots while playing the game. Mostly we've been getting critic for having too many slots too keep track of ;D

    I get that some hardcore players would want more slots to play around with, especially when you reach the endgame and have more skills and items at your disposal, but I think the system we have in place now works quite smoothly for the controllers. If more people voice a concern about this however, we might have to rethink it though!
     
  3. Xaax

    Xaax Green Slime

    Well, I don't mean using the triggers for extra quickslots. What I mean is to give the player the ability to change through skills by using the triggers. This way you don't have to enter a menu system to change abilities. This way while you are in the middle of combat you can quickly scroll through abilities. So for instance if Right Trigger goes through your pool of abilities bound to Button One and Button One's ability at the start is Cloud Strike and you want to change it on the fly you press Right Trigger and it becomes let's say Ice Nova. And if we continue to press Right Trigger it will just go through the whole pool of abilities that the character possesses until we stop pressing the Right Trigger.

    Extra quickslots would only be helpful if players had the extra buttons to make use of them or if they wanted to continue to go into the menu to assign abilities to those quickslots.
     
  4. Aurophobia

    Aurophobia Halloweed

    Scrolling through skills may cause players to not be able to react quickly in a situation.

    Most people don't use that many skills to the point of having every slot full. You have 3 designated for Weapon, Bow, and Shield. That leaves 9 slots...9. In Arcade Mode, that will never be a problem. Story Mode, you could have 4 for all the potions, and still have 5 for skills, hell maybe 3 for skills and 2 for back and forth weapon swapping.

    IMO, the more you spread out your skill points, the less viable your character is going to be.
    The common setup is usually a hard hitting single target skill / self buff, a skill that dispatches multiple enemies easily, and possibly a support. Even when you get to a point where you'll have more skill points to toss around, why would you want 2 skills that have the same purpose, over a skill you like and a passive?
     
  5. Xaax

    Xaax Green Slime

    I guess people are having a hard time relating to the situation. If you have a controller you don't have over 25 keys to press that would correspond to movement, block, bow, primary attack, and any abilities you get, plus entering and exiting menus, etc. Most controllers have around 14 or so buttons, that's simply not enough to interface with the game. So, it isn't a question of having more slots. You can add an infinite number of slots and that wont give you any more control over the game. Slots =/= the ability to switch skills on the fly. And I'm not saying that I would want to gimp my character by having several skills at once. I just want to be able to have 3-4 skills and not have to go into a menu system every time I want to change them out.

    If you have ever played Mega Man X then you know what I am talking about. You can quickly use the trigger buttons to change abilities mid-fight without missing a beat. So, I propose integrating a system like that into the game.
     
  6. Aurophobia

    Aurophobia Halloweed

    I'm sorry for going down this road, but dude, what are you talking about?

    Dictating the situation, a button is going to do different things, it's not like I need 1 button for each action.
    A on a xbox controller will Guard for me normally, proceed in a conversation, interact with npc's, and is the "OK" button for navigating menu's. I don't need a button for each one of those actions, when one covers them all.

    I'm going to put this out here, HAVE YOU PLAYED THE GAME WITH A CONTROLLER YET?

    Like MANY, MANY, MAAAANY games out there, this game's controls are context-sensitive...aka your buttons will perform multiple actions depending on the scenario.
     
  7. Xaax

    Xaax Green Slime

    Yes, I have. If you read my first post I say that I have been playing with a controller. It is a SNES-type controller. So, 8 buttons and then the D-Pad.

    D-Pad is set up for directional control (seemed like the obvious choice), Start and Select are to bring up the menu and exit the menu. I have Left Trigger bound to Bow, and Right Trigger set to my Push-to-Talk for multiplayer. Y is my Normal Attack, B is Block, X is 1ST Skill, Y is 2ND Skill.

    Do you see how I am lacking a button or two? I don't have a button for a 3RD Skill, and I don't have a button for TAB which by default allows you to switch weapons, accessories, armor, etc quickly.
     
  8. Aurophobia

    Aurophobia Halloweed

    Why not get a controller that is actually compatible with this game?
    The whole gimmick of playing this game with a SNES controller is cool and all, but that's not how they designed this to be played.
     
  9. Xaax

    Xaax Green Slime

    Where does it say anything about any particular controller being incompatible with the game? I didn't know it was a gimmick to play an SNES style RPG with an SNES style controller. Forgive me. I thought that it would be appropriate to play a game that appeals to my desire to play an old school game with an old school controller.


    Edit:

    What controller would you recommend I use? I don't care for Xbox controllers.

    Also, this is a suggestion thread, so I'm not making a demand. I don't expect to get everything I wish for. And as I have told the devs already in their IRC channel, I really like this game. The amount of fun I have had with this game far exceeded my expectations. This one issue I have will not crush my desire to play. But if others experience the same problem then my hope is that they would reply to this thread and voice their concern. And if I happen to be in a very small minority, then I expect the devs to shrug their shoulders and move on to other things.
     
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2014
  10. Deudeu

    Deudeu Green Slime

    Playing with a snes controller shouln'd be a problem, if u don't add your push to talk thingy.
    The buttons on PS3 controllers works very well, just put the "on the fly gear swap" on select, and rotate skill (with are R2/L2) on L/R and here you go, loads of skills possible. (You'll just lack of the button which swap map/quest but it shouldn't be that big of a deal)
     
  11. Xaax

    Xaax Green Slime

    What is the difference between a PS2 controller and a PS3 controller? I have not played with a PS3 controller before.
     
  12. Deudeu

    Deudeu Green Slime

    It's stricly the same, and it's also pretty much the same as a snes controller, with 2 shoulder button added, and as in grindea R1/L1 (On the PSx) is "switch map/quest" and "Equip just looted gear" u can really play without them.
     
  13. Xaax

    Xaax Green Slime

    Ah. I originally wanted to play with a PSx controller, but I couldn't get it to work with the game. I figured maybe the USB adapter I had was the problem. A friend offered to get me a SNES style USB controller, and I thought that would not only work, but also make more sense considering the game in question. But no, not enough buttons :( . Looks like the PS3 controller also has a USB connector. Hrm...
     
  14. Aurophobia

    Aurophobia Halloweed

    PS3 works with I think the MotionJoy program, when set to XBOX 360 compatibility.
    Or any wired xbox 360 controller (wire being there for actual input, not charging)
    Just something with two trigger/buttons on each side, that way you'll have a proper way of utilizing the hotkeys.
     
  15. Teddy

    Teddy Developer Staff Member

    Xaax, how does your controller setup work? Do you map keyboard buttons to the controller?

    If so, if you can bind Left Shift and Left Control to the shoulder buttons, that would give the same effect. You can bind spells to Shift+[button] or Ctrl+[button] by holding down the modifier key when rebinding!
     
  16. Xaax

    Xaax Green Slime


    Yes, I have it setup so that keyboard buttons are mapped to the controller.

    And I didn't even consider that. That sounds like a pretty good solution. Thanks, Teddy!
     

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