Shield Alternatives

[Coercion]

I would like to see shield alternatives (e.g. Off-Hand Weapons, Weapon Upgrades, Trinkets, etc.) This would allow for more combat variety and let players trade the defensive combat mechanic for another stat or mechanic. I will update this thread and keep a running list of ideas for alternatives to the shield slot. Feel free to post item ideas with or without descriptions and I will add them to the list below. I believe that a shield can be kept in the inventory and equipped when required (e.g. during the perfect block challenge in the flying temple), so constantly having a shield equipped is not a necessity.

Alternative Shield Ideas:

Off-Hand Weapons
Whip: A very fast, very long ranged melee attack with almost negligible damage, interrupts.
Net: Can be thrown to catch (stun) an enemy
Spiked Chain: Similar to Scorpions "Get over here!" move (Mortal Combat)

Dual Weapons
Brass Knuckles: A very fast, but very short ranged melee attack with minimal damage.
Fighting Gloves: A very fast, but very short ranged melee attack with minimal damage.
Claws: A very fast, but very short ranged melee attack with minimal damage.
Katars: A very fast, but very short ranged melee attack with minimal damage.
Daggers: A very fast, but very short ranged melee attack with minimal damage.

Thrown Weapons
Boomerang: A slow range attack that can hit multiple enemies and loops back to the player.
Shuriken: A very fast short range attack with minimal damage and interrupts, quantity: 5.
Throwing Axe: A slow short range attack with high damage and interrupts, quantity: 5.
Throwing Knives: A fast short range attack with moderate damage and interrupts, quantity: 5.

Quasi Shields
Buckler Net: A buckler with a net attached with very low deflection, but the special ability of being throwable/catching the enemy (picture something similar to that of the Roman Gladiator who also wields a small trident with the shield/net). That way, it would functionally still be a shield, but one with minimal defense and a lot of utility.

Weapon Upgrades
Weapon Guard: Every time the player is hit there is a 2% chance to negate the damage.

Trinkets
Rabby Trinket: Increases attack speed by 5.
Boar Trinket: Increases movement speed by 10%.
Ghostly Trinket: Increases crit chance by 5.
Guardian Trinket: Increases defense by 15.

Traps
Bear Trap: Throws a bear trap on the ground that damages and snares the first enemy that steps on it, quantity: 3.
Fire Rune: Marks the ground with a rune that burns the first enemy that steps on it.

Miscellaneous
Lantern: Increases damage from fire spells by 10%.
Life Orb: Every time the player is hit the life orb gains 1 charge. After the life orb reaches 20 charges, the player is healed 10% of max health.
Vampiric Orb: Each hit on an enemy has a 2% chance to heal the player a small amount.
Necromatic Orb: Each enemy killed has a 2% chance to resurrect and fight for the player for 20 seconds (excluding bosses and elite mobs).
Lucky Charm: Increases card drop chance.

 

[TheSpaniard]

Secret of Mana had a lot of cool weapons, but here are some good offhand ideas: whip, net, or dagger.

Also, some other melee types would be cool for your main weapon, such as melee (brass knuckles/fighting gloves).\

Some other ranged: Boomerang, shuriken, etc.

 

[Own]

Shield isn't DEF. Shield is another mechanic entirely, which I'd say half the combat system is built around. It's a bit like trading Link's Shield for giving him 1 attack, or Megaman's charged blaster for the ability to shoot up. The shield is a required mechanic for several points in the Story and Arcade mode.

 

[TheSpaniard]

Yeah, I was thinking that, so this is how I think it could be implemented with unique off hand slots:

For instance, the net would be a buckler with a net attached or gripped with the same hand, but with very low deflection and have the special ability of being throwable/catching the enemy (picture something similar to that of the Roman Gladiator who also wields a small trident with the shield/net). That way, it would functionally still be a shield, but one with minimal defense and a lot of utility.

One of the coolest thing about Secret of Mana was the number of different weapons, each with their own abilities, that you could master. I hope they continue the spirit of that combat in SoG!

 

[Tylerthedragon]

The problem is the fact that the game is HEAVILY built around the shield. I feel like the only way to combat this is to add a dodging system, but that would make the shield a little pointless, as you can have a strong secondary weapon/ability and be able to dodge every single attack with similar benefits to Perfect Dodging with Dodging Slash.

 

[Coercion]

Shield isn't DEF. Shield is another mechanic entirely, which I'd say half the combat system is built around. It's a bit like trading Link's Shield for giving him 1 attack, or Megaman's charged blaster for the ability to shoot up. The shield is a required mechanic for several points in the Story and Arcade mode.

While I agree that a shield isn't just a stat, it is not needed and I would prefer to replace it with an offensive stat. The only time I felt I needed a shield was for the perfect block challenge in the flying temple (where I couldve equipped one). There are already plenty of ways to dodge enemies (dodging strike, piercing dash, moving, etc.) and if your ASPD is high enough, you can interupt or ministun most enemies with your basic attack.

 

[TheSpaniard]

While I agree that a shield isn't just a stat, it is not needed and I would prefer to replace it with an offensive stat. The only time I felt I needed a shield was for the perfect block challenge in the flying temple (where I couldve equipped one). There are already plenty of ways to dodge enemies (dodging strike, piercing dash, moving, etc.) and if your ASPD is high enough, you can interupt or ministun most enemies with your basic attack.

True, now that I think about it, you could always just carry around a shield in your inventory if you need one for some special utility. However, no point in excluding off hand to just shields, since the options are quite unlimited!

 

[Coercion]

no point in excluding off hand to just shields, since the options are quite unlimited!

I agree. I will update this thread and keep a running list of ideas for alternatives to the shield slot. Feel free to post item ideas with or without descriptions and I will add them to the list.

 

[Own]

While I agree that a shield isn't just a stat, it is not needed and I would prefer to replace it with an offensive stat.

Story Mode: Enraged Gigaslime (unless you can somehow outrun it), Frostling Boss (it homes in on you).
Arcade Mode: Gigaslime (There is no room to escape), Enraged Gigaslime, Frostling Boss.

There's also about a dozen enemies that having a shield makes killing really, really easier.

 

[TheSpaniard]

Story Mode: Enraged Gigaslime (unless you can somehow outrun it), Frostling Boss (it homes in on you).
Arcade Mode: Gigaslime (There is no room to escape), Enraged Gigaslime, Frostling Boss.

There's also about a dozen enemies that having a shield makes killing really, really easier.

Using an alternative off hand wouldn't mean that you can't carry a shield in your inventory.

 

[Coercion]

There's also about a dozen enemies that having a shield makes killing really, really easier.

Which is why the players who feel this way should still have the option to use a shield. Once again, I never used a shield throughout the story mode aside from the perfect block challenge (which took maybe 10 seconds).

 

[Own]

The real problem as I see it is it would also encourage the "burst bosses with raw DPS and don't care about damage, don't play around boss attacks, just hithithit" thing the devs tried to move away with with the Shadowclone nerf. If you can ditch your shield and get something to boost your attack... any skill goes completely out the window, I think.

Even in Secret of Mana you couldn't just burst down bosses, you had to find the attack vulnerability windows.

 

[Coercion]

The real problem as I see it is it would also encourage the "burst bosses with raw DPS and don't care about damage, don't play around boss attacks, just hithithit"

I don't see it that way at all. You cannot just stand there and hit Winter with or without a shield (unless you want to be pulverized by his abilities) which is the same for the Season Hydra (and most bosses). If anything, you have to move around boss attacks and plan your timing of attacks and hits more than you would with a shield. Just because you can put out more DPS doesn't mean you should (especially being more vulnerable without a shield) and it does not mean you will be able to kill a boss in a few seconds either.

 

[TheSpaniard]

I don't see it that way at all. You cannot just stand there and hit Winter with or without a shield (unless you want to be pulverized by his abilities) which is the same for the Season Hydra (and most bosses). If anything, you have to move around boss attacks and plan your timing of attacks and hits more than you would with a shield. Just because you can put out more DPS doesn't mean you should (especially being more vulnerable without a shield) and it does not mean you will be able to kill a boss in a few seconds either.

Besides the fact that it would be balanced, and many of the off hand alternatives could have more of a utility than relate directly to high DPS.

Shurikens are fast and throw very quickly, though low damage. Nets would deal no damage at all, but impede creatures small enough to get tangled in it.